FAIR PLAY

The Life and Times of Lee Harvey Oswald

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All Rights Reserved

Date: August 21, 1963.

Place: WDSU-Radio, New Orleans, Louisiana

Dramatis personae:

· William Stuckey—host.

· Lee Harvey Oswald—Secretary, New Orleans chapter, Fair Play for Cuba Committee.

· Carlos Bringuier—Cuban exile and delegate, Directorio Revolucionario Estudiantil (DRE).

· Ed Butler—Executive Vice President, Information Council of the Americas (INCA)

STUCKEY
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. This is William Stuckey, and tonight on Conversation Carte Blanche we bring you a discussion of the Fair Play for Cuba Committee and the question of U.S. relations with Cuba. With us in the studio are Mr. Lee Harvey Oswald, secretary of the New Orleans chapter of the Fair Play for Cuba Committee; Mr. Carlos Bringuier, Cuban refugee and New Orleans delegate of the Student Revolutionary Directorate, a Cuban exile organization; and Mr. Ed Butler, Executive Vice President of the Information Council of the Americas.

Mr. Oswald, perhaps you would begin by explaining the purposes and aims of the organization you represent.

OSWALD
Yes. The Fair Play for Cuba Committee is a national organization headquartered in New York City, having local chapters throughout the United States. Its purpose is to promote friendly relations between the United States and Cuba and to disseminate accurate information concerning the Cuban revolution. It opposes the present U.S. policy of hostility and economic blockade against Cuba and supports the right of the Cuban people to self-determination.

STUCKEY
And how long have you been secretary of the New Orleans chapter?

OSWALD
Since May of this year. I am, at the moment, the only active officer, as the chapter is newly organized.

STUCKEY
Mr. Bringuier, you are with the Student Revolutionary Directorate. Would you care to comment on Mr. Oswald’s statement?

BRINGUIER
Yes, thank you. I am a Cuban, and I can tell you that the organization Mr. Oswald represents has no support among the Cuban people. We who have lived under Castro know that he is a Communist and that Cuba today is not free. Mr. Oswald says his committee wants friendship with Cuba, but what he means is friendship with a Communist dictatorship.

STUCKEY
Mr. Oswald?

OSWALD
Mr. Bringuier has repeated the standard anti-Cuban propaganda. The Cuban revolution was a popular revolution of the people against the corrupt Batista regime, which was supported by American business interests. It is not a dictatorship, but a socialist government that has brought schools, hospitals, and land reform to the Cuban people.

BUTLER
Mr. Oswald, may I ask— are you a Communist?

OSWALD
I am a Marxist, but not a member of the Communist Party. Marxism is an economic and philosophical system; it is not synonymous with the Soviet Union. My beliefs are in keeping with the principles of scientific socialism.

STUCKEY
Then, Mr. Oswald, do you support the present Soviet government?

OSWALD
I support the right of all nations to follow their own path. The Soviet Union has made great strides in education and industry. I admire those achievements, but I am not a spokesman for the Soviet government.

BRINGUIER
Mr. Oswald lived in Russia. He married there. Yet now he pretends he is not a Communist! He is defending the same system that enslaved the Cuban people.

OSWALD
I lived in the Soviet Union for a time, yes. I found conditions there better in many respects than in capitalist countries. However, I returned to the United States of my own free will. I believe in socialism as a future for mankind, but I do not serve any foreign government.

STUCKEY
Mr. Butler?

BUTLER
Mr. Oswald, do you deny that Fidel Castro has admitted his movement is Marxist-Leninist and that he has aligned himself with the Soviet bloc?

OSWALD
He has declared that the Cuban revolution follows its own line. It is independent of Moscow. The United States forced Cuba to seek support from the socialist countries by its acts of hostility.

BRINGUIER
That is not true. Castro betrayed the revolution. He deceived the people and delivered Cuba to the Communists. I was there; I fought in the underground against Batista. We all wanted democracy—not dictatorship, red or otherwise.

OSWALD
Batista murdered thousands with American weapons. The Cuban people chose Castro. They continue to support him because he has given them dignity and independence.

STUCKEY
Gentlemen, perhaps we should turn now to the activities of the Fair Play for Cuba Committee here in New Orleans. Mr. Oswald, there was a recent incident involving your distributing leaflets on Canal Street which led to your arrest. Would you tell us what happened?

OSWALD
Yes. On August 9th I was distributing leaflets titled Hands Off Cuba! when several anti-Castro Cubans, including Mr. Bringuier, attacked me. We were all arrested, but the charges against me were dismissed. The incident shows the intolerance that exists against any view favorable to Cuba.

BRINGUIER
He was distributing Communist propaganda in the streets of New Orleans! We tried to reason with him. He became violent. The police came. He wants to make himself a martyr.

OSWALD
I was peacefully exercising my right to free speech. The Fair Play for Cuba Committee is a lawful organization. I have distributed literature before without incident.

STUCKEY
Mr. Oswald, were you paid by anyone for these activities?

OSWALD
No, sir. I paid for the leaflets myself.

BUTLER
How many members are in your chapter?

OSWALD
At present, five card-carrying members, though we have had interest from others. We hope to expand.

STUCKEY
Mr. Oswald, why do you believe the United States should change its policy toward Cuba?

OSWALD
Because our policy is based on falsehoods and fear. The Cuban revolution removed a brutal dictator who served American economic interests. Instead of welcoming the Cuban people into the family of nations, the United States sought to crush their independence. That policy is immoral and dangerous.

BUTLER
But you surely recognize, Mr. Oswald, that Cuba has become a base for Soviet power in the Western Hemisphere?

OSWALD
I recognize that Cuba has allied with nations willing to trade and cooperate with her. The U.S. blockade forced her to do so. The Cubans were not born Communists; they became so because Washington left them no other choice.

BRINGUIER
That is completely false! When Castro first came to power he denied being Communist, but within months he imprisoned or executed everyone who opposed him. Cuba is now a totalitarian state.

OSWALD
You cannot build schools and hospitals and destroy illiteracy in two years under dictatorship. The Cuban people have gained for the first time control of their own resources. Before Castro, American corporations owned nearly all of Cuba’s sugar, telephone, and public utilities. Now those profits remain in Cuba.

BUTLER
You compare Cuba with capitalist countries, yet the Cuban economy is collapsing. There is rationing; there is repression. Do you deny that?

OSWALD
I do not deny difficulties, but they are the difficulties of progress. When Russia first turned to socialism there was hardship. But today the Soviet Union is a powerful, educated society. Cuba is following the same road, and it will surpass the conditions of Latin American nations still bound to U.S. monopolies.

BRINGUIER
You insult the free nations of Latin America by saying that communism is progress! Look at the refugees. Hundreds of thousands have fled Cuba. Do they flee prosperity?

OSWALD
Every revolution produces those who cannot or will not adapt. The refugees are largely from the former privileged classes—Batista police, landlords, and businessmen who lived off the people.

BUTLER
You make it sound as though Castro is the savior of mankind. But what about freedom of speech, of the press, of religion? These are basic rights. Does Cuba have them?

OSWALD
The Cuban press serves the revolution, yes. But freedom of the press in America means freedom for those who own the press. A worker cannot buy a newspaper to print the truth. In Cuba, the press is used for the benefit of the people as a whole.

BRINGUIER
That is the voice of communism, ladies and gentlemen! He admits it. No freedom, only the so-called “benefit of the people.” He has taken the side of the oppressors.

OSWALD
You misunderstand, or you choose to misunderstand. I believe socialism represents the next stage of human development. Cuba has simply reached it before other Latin American countries.

STUCKEY
Mr. Oswald, are you saying that the Cuban system is superior to that of the United States?

OSWALD
Economically and socially, yes, in many respects. Before the revolution Cuba was dominated by gambling, prostitution, and foreign control. Today every child can read and every man and woman has a right to work. The United States could learn from such measures.

BUTLER
Are you saying that Cuba is better off than Russia was before communism?

OSWALD
Indeed. Before communism Russia was a feudal empire with no industrial base. Cuba had a modern economy, though dependent on the United States. The Cuban revolution started from a higher level and therefore can advance more rapidly. That is why I have said Cuba today is better off than Russia was before 1917—and why its future is bright.

BRINGUIER
Mr. Oswald speaks as though he were Cuban. But he is an American who betrays his own country by defending our enemies. If Cuba is paradise, why does he not live there?

OSWALD
I am an American who believes my country should live up to its ideals. I do not betray America by seeking peace and understanding between nations. I betray no one.

STUCKEY
Gentlemen, let us return to the issue of the Fair Play for Cuba Committee. Mr. Oswald, some have accused your group of being financed or directed by the Castro government. Is that true?

OSWALD
It is not. We receive no aid from any foreign government. We depend solely upon American citizens who believe that friendship and trade are better than hostility and war.

BUTLER
Do you communicate with Cuban officials?

OSWALD
I have written to the Cuban embassy in Washington to request literature, as any citizen may. That is all.

BRINGUIER
He is too modest. He wrote to the Soviet embassy too! He says he wants friendship, but it is friendship with tyrants.

OSWALD
I have corresponded with many people, Mr. Bringuier. It is called free inquiry. You might try it.

STUCKEY
Mr. Oswald, how do you justify the presence of Soviet troops and missiles in Cuba last year?

OSWALD
That crisis was exaggerated by our own government. Cuba had every right to defend itself. After the Bay of Pigs invasion it was natural that Cuba would seek weapons from nations willing to provide them. The U.S. would have done the same in reverse.

BUTLER
But those missiles were aimed at us!

OSWALD
They were a deterrent. The real aggression came from the United States. Once we pledged not to invade Cuba, the missiles were removed. That proves Cuba wanted peace, not war.

BRINGUIER
Castro serves Moscow, and Moscow serves world communism. There is no peace in that.

OSWALD
There will be no peace so long as men like you stir hatred instead of understanding.

STUCKEY
Gentlemen, please. Let us maintain order. We have only a few minutes left. I would like each of you to summarize his position before we close. Before we end, I’ll ask each of you to give a brief closing statement. Mr. Bringuier, you may begin.

BRINGUIER
Thank you. I want to say to the American people that what you have heard tonight from Mr. Oswald is the same propaganda we heard in Cuba from Fidel Castro. He said the revolution was for liberty and justice, but soon he was killing those who disagreed with him. Cuba is now a prison. I fought in the underground against Batista for a free Cuba, not for communism. I ask Americans to remember that what happened to us can happen here if we listen to the lies of Marxists and enemies of freedom.

STUCKEY
Thank you, Mr. Bringuier. Mr. Butler, your statement.

BUTLER
Yes. I think the listeners should remember that the Fair Play for Cuba Committee, represented by Mr. Oswald, supports a government that has declared itself part of the Communist bloc. Mr. Oswald has admitted tonight that he is a Marxist. He has attempted to defend tyranny in the name of progress. We in the United States must recognize that communism is a system opposed to everything this nation stands for— our faith, our freedom, and our rights as individuals. I am grateful to WDSU for letting the public hear this discussion, because it shows clearly the nature of those who defend Castro’s Cuba.

STUCKEY
Thank you, Mr. Butler. And now, Mr. Oswald, your concluding remarks.

OSWALD
Yes. I believe history will judge our actions, not our words. The Cuban Revolution represents the struggle of an oppressed people to achieve social and economic justice. It is not a conspiracy against the United States, but an example to all nations that wish to free themselves from exploitation. The Fair Play for Cuba Committee seeks understanding between our country and Cuba. We do not advocate subversion or violence. We advocate friendship, cultural exchange, and peace. Those who call this “communism” misuse the word. I have lived under capitalism and under socialism. I prefer the system which gives dignity to the worker and hope to the poor. That is what I believe, and that is why I speak as I do.

STUCKEY
Mr. Oswald, Mr. Bringuier, Mr. Butler—thank you for appearing on Conversation Carte Blanche. I hope our listeners have found this program informative. Good night from WDSU Radio in New Orleans.